Its like Hillary walking into a working class kitchen for the first time.

They’ve been shielded from even critical support of China and other AES for so long they literally, not figuratively, literally cannot process that people exist that have beliefs that aren’t Reddit Approved. They immediately assume it’s bots or wumao. Human beings can’t possibly hold these beliefs, so they must be Oriental hordes or actual robots.

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26 points

Dogmatism and ideological purity are blinding you. It certainly should be a conversation about why billionaires exist in China, especially as they strengthen their safeguards against capital flight, but their existence alone does not discredit the great strides of progress China has made under SwCC in under a century. There are few examples of such a large mass of people seeing such substantive improvements in their lives. No matter the system, such dramatic change will result in unforseen consequences because there is so much change occuring. The measure of the response though is what is important: protecting themselves from capital flight, placing party leadership within corporations, focusing on carbon reduction through reduced pollution, tree planting, and alternative energy sources are all measurable ways the government is correcting. Where else do you see such response by those in power for their citizens? The Chinese approval for their government is incredibly high, and this is why

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2 points

Is Chinese capitalism efficient, and has the government helped the people’s material conditions (other than minorities/dissidents)? Yes. Are they aiming for socialism? No.

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21 points

Counter point: yes they are.

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2 points

So I gather that the relatively few dissidents in mainstream media is how you decide that there is excessive repression? Could it be that so many in China approve of their government that there just aren’t many dissidents and those who do speak out aren’t covered in the media you consume unless they face consequences?

As far as minorities, there has been progress for the LGBTQ+ community as well as religious minorities and other races. Could it be better and faster? Certainly, but that doesn’t mean it’s not happening or they are regressing.

As far as whether they are progressing towards socialism, if you believe Marx and Lenin, state capitalism is a necessary step towards communism and is generally accepted as ‘socialism’. What do you then classify as socialism?

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