I have an appointment with a psychiatrist that is probably going to suggest me to try a SRRI meds for seasonal depression and I’m a bit apprehensive to try it because I’m already on adderall for adhd. Does anyone have experience with this combination? I’ve read so far that it’s possible but that the breakdown rate is lower so I’d need to be on smaller dosage.
I will obviously talk with my psychiatrist about my worries but I’d just like to be prepared a bit because my experience with psychiatrists is that they’re really eager to get you on meds but don’t really give a lot of info on them.
I am open to try it because my seasonal depression is debilitating and I feel like I’ve exhausted all other options in trying to ease it without satisfying results (except moving but that’s not possible currently)
I’ve thought about the possibility of just not using the adderall in the winter while I take the ssri because maybe the ssri would alleviate some of the adhd symptoms.
Any insights would be greatly appreciated.
apologies, as my situation is similar on the face of it but completely different for every single variable you mentioned, but to throw it in:
I was longer-term on SNRIs before an ADHD diagnosis (like absolutely confirmed, i’ve never passed a test so convincingly lmao) and starting Ritalin gave me a marked improvement to the point that I put off an imminent dosage increase of my desvenlafaxine (because my ADHD symptoms were being addressed).
I’m going to leave it to others who are more experienced with your combination and more versed in the literature, but if you want the anecdotal opinion of a random nerd who will be thinking about this all day: the two-pronged approach helped me immensely personally, and I would assume much more so than a simple increase of one or the other. Antidepressants though are always an inexact science, and I definitely don’t mean that in a crank way, but I mean that the prescription is issued to deal with how we feel - and even when we don’t know how we feel, no one else can know because there’s no blood tests or scans or whatever. So you’ll just have to monitor and be honest with yourself and your doctor when thinking about how much it’s helped, if anything is making you feel worse, and if the combination is suddenly making you concerned about any symptoms or issues. If it feels wrong, it’s wrong.
also, you want to know something that seems to absolutely fucking crater the effectiveness of Ritalin but there doesn’t seem to be much research on the interaction? Diabetes meds.
Dunno if it’s the metformin or ozempic (lmao) but fucking hell, i’m feeling like the ritalin hits half as hard these days.
TLDR: Expect the process to take a long time and to cycle through many drugs. Avoid MAOIs with Vyvanse (with few exceptions), try to vary your drug class instead of taking multiples of very similar drugs until you start to find something that works, then focus on finding one within the class that is most effective and has the least side effects that are most tolerable. A little bit of reading goes a long way toward understanding what you are taking before you start taking it. Drugs.com is a good place to start unless you like scientific literature. Seek out therapy during this process because it’s discouraging. Check out dialectical behavioral therapy.
The long-winded, ranty version:
Don’t expect a miracle with the SSRIs or anything similar. They feel pretty hand-wavy compared to most meds due to the nature of psychological symptom monitoring and how life can interfere with this. It is no exaggeration to say this is a game of guess and check. This process takes forever and sucks.
You may be offered a pharmacogenetics test to help guide this process. Get it if you want it and if it won’t cost you a bunch, but quite frankly, the diagnostic use of these tests is fairly immature and doesn’t seem particularly useful at the current time. I suspect it will improve in the future, but it’s a waste of money currently IMO and I’m someone who thinks pharmacogenetics are cool.
There are a lot of SSRIs, SNRIs and SSBULLSHITS out there. I suggest that while playing the guess and check game, you try to spread the focus around to drugs that are dissimilar. Different classes, ones that act on mechanisms that aRe relatively different rather than ones that are similar. Providers like to go down the cu king list and be like “sertealine, venlafaxine, fluoxitine, Trintellix, escitalopram, mirteazapine, blah blah blah” and they are all relatively similar.
Try an SSRI, try bupropion XR, try a mood stabilizer like lamotrigine (if you do this one, you need to titrate up slowly as it can cause severe allergic reactions if you jump in quickly), then try a low dose of lithium (<=400mg). This is in no particular order. If you are willing, try a tricyclic antidepressant (old-school, normally not used anymore because they make you drowsy. Low doses of amitriptyline are fucking great for sleep granted that you never ever ever miss a dose and you ignore the first week on and first week off).
There are MAO inhibitors too, but this is one I would suggest avoiding and you will likely see suggestions for that everywhere. Aside from everyone needing a little Mao in their lives, MAO inhibitors tend to require some dietary restrictions and lead to heart and blood pressure problems when combined with amphetamines (Adderall, Vyvanse). It is possible the combination could work with the addition of a blood pressure medication, but I’d try it as a last resort. Too many things to worry about, too many life changes, additional medications and higher risk.
I’m diagnosed with ADHD, MDD, and experience seasonal affect. These have been persistent for over 20 years. The only medication that has ever helped with symptoms of either is amphetamines and I prefer lisdexamfetamine (Vyvanse) because it has all the benefits of Adderall with none of the side effects. The only downside is if your supply gets cut off suddenly, and I find that I have 2 weeks of withdrawal symptoms with the majority taking place from days 2 to 4 after my last dose. There’s a 3-5 day period where I have side effects while getting back on it with the majority of side effects (increased resting heart rate in particular) take place over day 1 and 2 of being back on my dose. For reference, I use 50-70 mg, the only difference being how long the effects last.
I’ve tried just about every SSRI, SNRI, and similar. The only one that I can remember not trying is vilazodone. I’ve taken mood stabilizers, bupropion, tricyclics, weed, and booze. None of these helped with depression. I tried high doses of vitamin D despite this being the biggest fucking cop-out a provider can give for any type of persistent depression. If you encounter this pointedly ask them if they really think a change in vitamin D is going to have a significant effect on your depression. A small one, some relief for seasonal affect, I can give them those, but if they refuse to try something else until you go with a high dose of vitamin D, they aren’t serious about your treatment. I know there is scientific evidence for it, but I’ve always found that the providers who lean into this early aren’t team players and should be dropped for a different provider quickly.
I haven’t tried lithium or MAOIs at this time and am currently considering just coping with being depressed constantly again while not taking drugs that do nothing for me. I’ll let my therapist be the voice of reason.
My work is in pharmaceutical R&D, but not specifically with antidepressants. The field I’m in is small enough that I prefer not to associate it with my account, but my background gives me enough confidence to inform myself on these and similar drugs through the literature. Some of what I deal with is drug interactions and delivery, so this is close enough to home.
I find that despite working with these drugs daily, most medical providers do not look into this with much depth, so it’s pretty easy to get ahead of their specific knowledge on drugs just by reading a little. One example is the interaction between amphetamines and some antidepressants that you mentioned. This isn’t meant to disparage medical workers, there’s just a shit-ton of drugs out there and they need to cover a wide field of knowledge.
My journey may not be very inspiring, perhaps because it’s not over, but you should understand that searching for an effective antidepressant is a roll of the dice and can take a lot of time and frustration unless you get lucky and find one that works for you quickly. It can take years and you may not find any relief this season, so be patient and seek additional relief such as therapy. I know cognitive behavior therapy is in vogue, but have you heard of dialectical behavioral therapy? It includes some of the CBT strategies, but it’s similar to dialectical philosophy, which us Marxists drool over…give it a try and good luck!
This is super informative, thanks! I hadn’t heard about dialect behavioural therapy but it’s a nice rabbit hole that I will dive into and maybe mention to my therapist. Reading about it, it honestly sounds like how my most of my therapists have approached CBT for me, as they have always focused on acceptance and mindfulness before seeing if there were any harmful habits that I could work on to change. These methods have been successful for me as I’ve gained a lot more control over my emotions.
I have some generational medical trauma which gives me some anxiety when about taking medications but it really helps to be able to read a little about it before and to hear about positive experiences. Hopefully I’ll find something that helps but you’re probably right in that my expectations shouldn’t be too high. Aderall changed my life immediately which was awesome but antidepressants seem a bit more complicated.
GOOD advice. I called a uh, “pharmacological audible” switching from Sertraline (Zoloft) to Bupropion XR by asking an RN to prescribe the latter during my 1st quarter of pharm sci/med chem PhD after the Sertraline showed signs it definitely wasn’t working. Felt much better but they still mastered me out a couple years later. I went off it during COVID just to see how I’d fare without & was mostly fine at my 1st job out of school working at a drug delivery startup, but have been considering going back on it; like MeowZedong said, this is a small field & I feel like I’m having a hard time staying motivated to apply for job listings that may get as many as ~500 applicants—all more credentialed than I—ever since that 4 person startup I was working for went under last year.
One thing to note with Bupropion is skipping 4 days can cause mild amphetamine psychosis, so don’t learn that the hard way when transferring the prescription to a pharmacy that’s closed on weekends. 3-chloro- N-tert butylcathinone, where cathinone is the active ingredient of khat, might’ve been a giveaway with a pharmacophore like that!
Keep a journal and track your mood or thoughts when you start if you can, SSRIs can make you manic (bad) if you have anything undiagnosed like bipolar or borderline personality disorder.
Strattera is also a mild SNRI antidepressant that is a good substitute for Ritalin or Vyvanse/Adderall.
Good advice.
An additional substitute for consideration is Intuniv (guanfacine, different doses are used for treating hypertension). This is also a good candidate for combining with a lower dose of methylphenidate if one of these substitutes is not effective enough to replace the normal ADHD stimulants.
I’m on Vyvanse and Lexapro and both are working pretty well for me. I’m sure your doctor is already aware of this, but you might need to drop your stimulant dose a bit when starting SSRIs since they can definitely interact.
I wouldn’t recommend switching to just taking SSRIs in the winter. They didn’t do anything for my ADHD before I started simulants. I’ve also had supply interruptions of my Vyvanse before and went back to just Lexapro and I almost got canned due to productivity issues.
Another thing that could just be a me thing, if I end up missing a dose (of both because I take them at the same time), I will feel like garbage. I didn’t have this problem when I was only taking SSRIs by themselves. Just something to watch out for.
Of course, your mileage may vary; I’m not a doctor, and all that.
I feel like garbage too when I miss my aderall dose so it might be the vyvanse for you as well. But the feeling disappears after a few days in my case. You’re probably right in that the combination will probably help me much more than just one of the two. I just wasn’t sure if this is a common combination but it seems like it works for some people here which is really reassuring. Thanks for sharing!
Edit: I missed that you mentioned this in your original post. Nevermind!
Big drug mixture warning: be careful mixing Vyvanse/Adderall and fluoxitine/Prozac. Fluoxitine can end up making the effects of amphetamines stronger than normal, even for Vyvanse.
Normally, because Vyvanse is a pro-drug that requires enzymatic degradation to become active, the only effect a higher dose will have is a longer effect. Fluoxitine affects interactions with the active drug and how long it is in your system, overriding the pro-drug effect. This can lead to (likely minor) overdose effects. You’ll be able to tell if this is happening because you’ll get similar side effects as are often experienced with Adderall that you normally don’t experience on Vyvanse. Think of the ones normally associated with Adderall IR.
This doesn’t mean they can’t be mixed, just that you should watch how you react to the doses of each when mixing. You may find that you need to reduce your dose of Vyvanse if you go to a high enough dose of fluoxitine.
Yeah, this is a pretty standard combo, I live in an area where psychs don’t really like prescribing anything harder than tylenol without you already being prescribed an SSRI. I find that (the correct) SSRIs help a lot with stimulant side effects, so that may help there. I wouldn’t suggest alternating the two for seasons, the SSRI will help with energy but doesn’t do much for ADHD, just depression energy.
Personally really love my SSRI, Zoloft. Things were really dark before I got on it. Finding the right SSRI took a little bit though, and the ones that didn’t work sucked ass. But it’s part of the journey, it’s not your doctor being a schmuck
